03/07: RV shows
RV shows have been going on for over 40 years and still prove to be more popular today than ever. Most reports this year show record or near-record attendance around the country. My take on it is there is some pent-up demand and the easiest way to shop is to go to a show.
Why is that? Well, let me count the ways! 1. All the dealers put in their best-selling models plus all the new innovations and new floorplans. 2. Competition is at its highest level, so the prices are lower. 3. Look at coaches indoors out of the weather. 4. Coaches are likely to be spiffed up and decorated to get everyone in the mood. 5. You're likely be left alone to look, but you can get questions answered quickly if you desire. 6. Factory reps in attendance can answer some questions dealership personnel can't. 7. Lots of cool booths--some of which have nothing to do with RVs! 8. Usually very inexpensive admission. 9. Everything in one place to save gas running all over town to look. I'm sure there are more good things, but those come quickly to mind.
We're getting ready for our big spring show that begins this Thursday and ends next Sunday. We'll take down 40 or 50 units. Countless hours go into the planning and execution. Getting the units washed, detailed and ready to tow. Getting the right units hooked up (every show it seems we somehow get 1 or 2 wrong units and have to bring them back!) Getting a forklift down to the fairgrounds to move the units in tight places. Banners, sale signs, carpet, extension cords, adapters, brochures, cleaning supplies, sales agreements, appraisal books, tables, chairs, decorations, light bulbs, flashers, tape, fuses, ladders and scores of other things needed to put on a show.
And then after everyone is exhausted and the show is over, we have to break everything down and bring things back. Hopefully, not too many things are broken or scuffed up and there are lots of sold signs put up. We actually have a large trailer that we leave the show items in that we don't use any other time.
When we get back, there's no let up for weeks. Customers pour in to buy who didn't make up their mind at the show. The sales lot rows are a disaster and must be put back neat. We're trying to schedule deliveries that work for both us and the customer, while in many cases, we're still trying to get loans arranged. Service seems in chaos while working in the sales deliveries and regular service. Still, it's exciting and a sense of achievement if felt by all.
To show goers, everything may seem orderly and easy. However, we're like the duck gliding across the pond. It seems effortless, but underneath we're paddling like crazy!
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Why is that? Well, let me count the ways! 1. All the dealers put in their best-selling models plus all the new innovations and new floorplans. 2. Competition is at its highest level, so the prices are lower. 3. Look at coaches indoors out of the weather. 4. Coaches are likely to be spiffed up and decorated to get everyone in the mood. 5. You're likely be left alone to look, but you can get questions answered quickly if you desire. 6. Factory reps in attendance can answer some questions dealership personnel can't. 7. Lots of cool booths--some of which have nothing to do with RVs! 8. Usually very inexpensive admission. 9. Everything in one place to save gas running all over town to look. I'm sure there are more good things, but those come quickly to mind.
We're getting ready for our big spring show that begins this Thursday and ends next Sunday. We'll take down 40 or 50 units. Countless hours go into the planning and execution. Getting the units washed, detailed and ready to tow. Getting the right units hooked up (every show it seems we somehow get 1 or 2 wrong units and have to bring them back!) Getting a forklift down to the fairgrounds to move the units in tight places. Banners, sale signs, carpet, extension cords, adapters, brochures, cleaning supplies, sales agreements, appraisal books, tables, chairs, decorations, light bulbs, flashers, tape, fuses, ladders and scores of other things needed to put on a show.
And then after everyone is exhausted and the show is over, we have to break everything down and bring things back. Hopefully, not too many things are broken or scuffed up and there are lots of sold signs put up. We actually have a large trailer that we leave the show items in that we don't use any other time.
When we get back, there's no let up for weeks. Customers pour in to buy who didn't make up their mind at the show. The sales lot rows are a disaster and must be put back neat. We're trying to schedule deliveries that work for both us and the customer, while in many cases, we're still trying to get loans arranged. Service seems in chaos while working in the sales deliveries and regular service. Still, it's exciting and a sense of achievement if felt by all.
To show goers, everything may seem orderly and easy. However, we're like the duck gliding across the pond. It seems effortless, but underneath we're paddling like crazy!
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
03/02: Newmar Owner Loyalty Rebate
Newmar just emailed me a new program for March. On any Essex order or purchase from a dealer's stock during the month of March will be eligible for a cash rebate of $20,000 if you are an existing owner of a Newmar product! 5th wheel or motorhome will be eligible. If you own a competitor's product, you can claim a $15,000 rebate!
The rebate can be sent to the customer or can be applied to the deal. The rebate won't be released until the new Essex is paid for. If a stock unit is purchased (can be a 2010 or older) the dealer will have to reorder to get the cash rebate. No reorder is required if special ordered for a customer.
This is great news that should shake up a lot of fence sitters. We are already working a lot of Newmar Essex deals and this should add fuel to the fire. In fact, the last time I had so many Newmar deals working at the same time was 5 or 6 years ago! This matches up with RVIA reporting today that wholesale shipments for January more than doubled from January, 2009.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
The rebate can be sent to the customer or can be applied to the deal. The rebate won't be released until the new Essex is paid for. If a stock unit is purchased (can be a 2010 or older) the dealer will have to reorder to get the cash rebate. No reorder is required if special ordered for a customer.
This is great news that should shake up a lot of fence sitters. We are already working a lot of Newmar Essex deals and this should add fuel to the fire. In fact, the last time I had so many Newmar deals working at the same time was 5 or 6 years ago! This matches up with RVIA reporting today that wholesale shipments for January more than doubled from January, 2009.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
02/28: Depreciation
I had several readers ask me to clarify the depreciation schedule I posted in the last blog on trade-in values. The confusion seemed to center around whether the depreciation should be taken from the list price or the purchase price.
All depreciation figures were from the net sales cost new, after the discount. In the example, the 15% depreciation would be from the $280K figure--not $350K. The estimated value after year one would be $238K and $210K after year 2. Year 3 would be $196K. Those are just estimated figures for all RVs. The better brands will depreciate less as there are more buyers for them. Maybe 10%, 5% and 3%.
The first year or two is where you will find the most volatility. The reason is some buyers will pay more or less for the used unit, depending on the perceived purchase price of a comparably equipped new coach. If, in the above example, a buyer thought that they would have to pay $300K for a new unit after discount, he might pay $250K for the year old coach--figuring that he was saving $50K over that new coach with a new warranty. On the other hand, if he thought he could buy the new coach for $265K, he might only be willing to pay $215K--or maybe he thinks a $35K savings is enough and is willing to pay $230K!
All buyers are a little different and the savings they are willing to accept to buy a 1, 2, or 3 year old coach over a new one, varies from buyer to buyer. Hence, the volatility. The books are normally too high the first 2 or 3 years, which adds to the confusion and volatility. Imagine finding the above coach in the NADA book after 2 years at $285K wholesale before options and $375K average retail. Happens all the time. The high book helps with getting a loan on the coach, but doesn't help customers understand what the unit is really worth.
The reason you will see wholesale and retail figures for year or two old units that are higher than when new is the little game the manufacturers play with NADA. They all end up quoting retail prices at what they think most coaches will list for after adding options. If they don't, the values will be lower than a competitor with the same wholesale price to the dealer. This would devalue their product and be used against them by competitors. Of course, it also helps the customers who purchase them as they can point to the book value and then to their lower price they are willing to sell. Hope this makes this a little more clear.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
All depreciation figures were from the net sales cost new, after the discount. In the example, the 15% depreciation would be from the $280K figure--not $350K. The estimated value after year one would be $238K and $210K after year 2. Year 3 would be $196K. Those are just estimated figures for all RVs. The better brands will depreciate less as there are more buyers for them. Maybe 10%, 5% and 3%.
The first year or two is where you will find the most volatility. The reason is some buyers will pay more or less for the used unit, depending on the perceived purchase price of a comparably equipped new coach. If, in the above example, a buyer thought that they would have to pay $300K for a new unit after discount, he might pay $250K for the year old coach--figuring that he was saving $50K over that new coach with a new warranty. On the other hand, if he thought he could buy the new coach for $265K, he might only be willing to pay $215K--or maybe he thinks a $35K savings is enough and is willing to pay $230K!
All buyers are a little different and the savings they are willing to accept to buy a 1, 2, or 3 year old coach over a new one, varies from buyer to buyer. Hence, the volatility. The books are normally too high the first 2 or 3 years, which adds to the confusion and volatility. Imagine finding the above coach in the NADA book after 2 years at $285K wholesale before options and $375K average retail. Happens all the time. The high book helps with getting a loan on the coach, but doesn't help customers understand what the unit is really worth.
The reason you will see wholesale and retail figures for year or two old units that are higher than when new is the little game the manufacturers play with NADA. They all end up quoting retail prices at what they think most coaches will list for after adding options. If they don't, the values will be lower than a competitor with the same wholesale price to the dealer. This would devalue their product and be used against them by competitors. Of course, it also helps the customers who purchase them as they can point to the book value and then to their lower price they are willing to sell. Hope this makes this a little more clear.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Contrary to popular opinion, the difference between asking price/
list price and the selling price is not for the dealer to make more
money off a naive customer. It is to cover a trade-in that the
customer has an unrealistic view of what it's worth. Negotiating a
difference figure is indeed the best way to go if you don't want the
hassle of selling your old unit yourself.
In most cases, a dealer is going to ACV (actual cash value) your
trade at base NADA wholesale/average trade-in with no adds. Any
reconditioning required to be deducted from this. No matter what you
are shown for your trade on paper, you are going to get wholesale for
your trade. The dealer will not sell 2 units for the same profit as
selling 1. He deserves to make a little on both.
The problem lies in that many don't understand that the only thing
that matters is the money you're having to part with, in addition
your old coach, to get your new coach (difference figure). So many
get hung up on what they are getting for their old coach. Many
expect to buy at the selling price, which is very close to wholesale,
and still get close to retail value for their trade. Just not going
to happen unless the dealer has a dog that he's had forever.
Dealers have found that it's much more palatable to give a smaller
discount from the list price or no discount at all and put the rest
in the trade. For example, let's say you have a motorhome trade that
has a book wholesale value of $100,000 and a book retail value of
$150,000. From a dealer perspective, he knows he's going to have to
spend some money to get the unit reconditioned and he also knows that
he's not going to get anything near the $150,000 figure when he sells
it. (No one is going to pay the retail figure. He may ask $149,900
because the book with options could support it. But,
he'll be lucky to get much more than $110K-$120K on a no-trade basis
after prep costs).
Now, let's say you're looking at a $350K retail Newmar. Selling
price of $280K. ACV on the trade of $95K. Leaves a
difference of $185K. There are 3 basic ways this unit can be
priced.
1. $350K and give the customer $160K for trade for a difference of $185K.
2. $325K and give the customer $140K for trade for a difference of $185K
3. $280K and give the customer $95K for trade for a difference of $185K
Most customers will think their trade is worth at least $125K to $150K since they all think their coach is way above average. A certain number of
customers you will have no chance if you use #3. Not only will you not sell them, you'll make them mad! A certain number will want a
discount and give them retail for theirs. In #2, you could give a $25K discount and still give them more than they think theirs is
worth.
I personally like #1 best, because it covers all buyers if you
explain it correctly. You can explain that you're giving them $185K
for their trade, but that you both know that their trade is not worth
$185K. The $185K is what their trade is worth plus what I can
discount the coach. "And besides, the difference figure is what
really counts, right?"
Bottom line is that no matter how you price, some people just aren't
going to like the way you do it. NOTE: It is harder to trade used
for used as there is less mark-up in used than new.
As far as depreciation is concerned, it all has to do with how much
most people would expect in a discount from new to get them to opt
for a pre-owned coach. There are no hard rules, but the lower
inflation of new prices, the higher the depreciation. Also, the more
desirable the unit, the less the depreciation. Late model pre-owned
Newmars are coveted, so depreciation will tend to be less than other
brands.
Overall in the industry a quick rule of thumb could be as follows:
15% first year, 10% in the second, 5% in the third year, and 2% thereafter. Newmar and Jayco might be a little less because of their reputation.
Go camping more--Have more fun! Lee
list price and the selling price is not for the dealer to make more
money off a naive customer. It is to cover a trade-in that the
customer has an unrealistic view of what it's worth. Negotiating a
difference figure is indeed the best way to go if you don't want the
hassle of selling your old unit yourself.
In most cases, a dealer is going to ACV (actual cash value) your
trade at base NADA wholesale/average trade-in with no adds. Any
reconditioning required to be deducted from this. No matter what you
are shown for your trade on paper, you are going to get wholesale for
your trade. The dealer will not sell 2 units for the same profit as
selling 1. He deserves to make a little on both.
The problem lies in that many don't understand that the only thing
that matters is the money you're having to part with, in addition
your old coach, to get your new coach (difference figure). So many
get hung up on what they are getting for their old coach. Many
expect to buy at the selling price, which is very close to wholesale,
and still get close to retail value for their trade. Just not going
to happen unless the dealer has a dog that he's had forever.
Dealers have found that it's much more palatable to give a smaller
discount from the list price or no discount at all and put the rest
in the trade. For example, let's say you have a motorhome trade that
has a book wholesale value of $100,000 and a book retail value of
$150,000. From a dealer perspective, he knows he's going to have to
spend some money to get the unit reconditioned and he also knows that
he's not going to get anything near the $150,000 figure when he sells
it. (No one is going to pay the retail figure. He may ask $149,900
because the book with options could support it. But,
he'll be lucky to get much more than $110K-$120K on a no-trade basis
after prep costs).
Now, let's say you're looking at a $350K retail Newmar. Selling
price of $280K. ACV on the trade of $95K. Leaves a
difference of $185K. There are 3 basic ways this unit can be
priced.
1. $350K and give the customer $160K for trade for a difference of $185K.
2. $325K and give the customer $140K for trade for a difference of $185K
3. $280K and give the customer $95K for trade for a difference of $185K
Most customers will think their trade is worth at least $125K to $150K since they all think their coach is way above average. A certain number of
customers you will have no chance if you use #3. Not only will you not sell them, you'll make them mad! A certain number will want a
discount and give them retail for theirs. In #2, you could give a $25K discount and still give them more than they think theirs is
worth.
I personally like #1 best, because it covers all buyers if you
explain it correctly. You can explain that you're giving them $185K
for their trade, but that you both know that their trade is not worth
$185K. The $185K is what their trade is worth plus what I can
discount the coach. "And besides, the difference figure is what
really counts, right?"
Bottom line is that no matter how you price, some people just aren't
going to like the way you do it. NOTE: It is harder to trade used
for used as there is less mark-up in used than new.
As far as depreciation is concerned, it all has to do with how much
most people would expect in a discount from new to get them to opt
for a pre-owned coach. There are no hard rules, but the lower
inflation of new prices, the higher the depreciation. Also, the more
desirable the unit, the less the depreciation. Late model pre-owned
Newmars are coveted, so depreciation will tend to be less than other
brands.
Overall in the industry a quick rule of thumb could be as follows:
15% first year, 10% in the second, 5% in the third year, and 2% thereafter. Newmar and Jayco might be a little less because of their reputation.
Go camping more--Have more fun! Lee
I've been out of town at a dealer meeting all week, but I noticed this posting on the IRV2 Country Coach owner's forum. Very interesting. Bob Lee bought the intellectual rights to the Country Coach for $160K. Still, there is much concern by the Country Coach owners for recovering the records on their coaches.
The following is a rather lengthy letter drafted by two coach owners...one an attorney and the other an engineer. I offer this as information only as to their extensive research in obtaining records of coaches built over the last 3 decades by Country Coach. The information in the subject files contains minimal information and may not even be as complete as the manuals and information forders provided with each coach. Other records that were stored in computers are virtually non-retrievable due to obsolete programs and lack of specific computer knowledge. I hope this investigation answers those owners who wished to secure these production records.
Respectively, Ted Wright, CCI President L041
COUNTRY COACH WILL BE SOLD AT AUCTION February 4, 2010 Country Coach filed bankruptcy in the Spring of 2009, seeking to reorganize and
continue (commonly referred to as a Chapter 11 Reorganization) . This can be viewed as an effort by the owners, managers and creditors, under the direction of the Court, to restructure the company in such a way that it can pay off its debts in some fashion and operate profitable in time. Due, in large part to the economy, a plan of reorganization could not be put together. The Country Coach matter was then converted from a reorganization to a liquidation (commonly referred to as a Chapter 7, or Straight bankruptcy) and, as the name implies, all of the assets of the company are sold and the proceeds, after all expenses and fees, are allocated among the creditors. The Country Coach auction is set for February 4, 2010. Country Coach, as we have known it through the manufacture of our coaches and annual homecomings and rallies, will be no more.
During the reorganization proceedings, we as Country Coach owners, could only wait and hope that the company would restructure and continue in business. However, when the proceeding was converted to a Chapter 7 and all of the assets were going to be sold at auction, several coach owners began to express concern, principally along the lines of servicing, maintaining and repairing our sizeable investment. More specifically, it narrowed to the question of parts lists, vendor sources, Build Sheets on each and every coach etc, etc. Unlike automobiles, coach's do not all have the same parts, and are not built alike. The question was raised as to how can one obtain this very important information on ones coach for future service, maintenance and repair.
During the last few weeks, we began to look for answers. We turned to the Court records (which are voluminous). We entered into discussions with the Bankruptcy Court Trustee appointed to conduct the auction, Mr. Kenneth Eisler. We reviewed the public information on the sale which listed the assets, one of which was designated as Intellectual Property. Unlike the hard assets of Country Coach such as molds, carpentry tools, (even several coaches in various stages of being built), the Technical Manuals, Build Sheets, engineering drawings, parts lists, vendor lists; everything you might want to know about your coach, all fell as an asset of the company within the category of Intellectual Property. Interestingly, that includes the name "Country Coach" and the various trademarks any patents.
Focusing on this asset we endeavored to determine specifically what was included in the Intellectual Property asset that would be of greatest value to coach owners and in what format. Gary Obermeier, former Senior Vice President of Operations, and a 30 year employee of Country Coach was most helpful and accommodating in this regard. He identified 17 pallets containing boxes of paper all sealed in shrink wrap. Although voluminous he described these records as raw data, largely unorganized, certainly nothing that would provide anything of real value to a coach owner. It was his judgment that the kinds of data that would be both complete and organized were stored electronically. This data would include, for each coach, the drawings, parts numbers, vendor of parts etc. The impossible task was to secure the hardware and software and the knowledge of former CC employees who could still pull from this data. The program no longer exists for extracting the data except as is presently on site in the company's computer room.
It was only last week that we had a full understanding of the nature of information which we thought would be helpful to coach owners and most importantly, its format. Faced with this description of the Intellectual Property, the 17 pallets were deemed to be of no value. Turning to the electronic data base it should be noted that the Trustee, in his responsibility to sell assets, did not maintain a staff that might download electronically stored information. We would have had to hire several key former employees of the company for this work.
A few Prevost owners took it upon themselves to send a person to Eugene for an on-site look. Over the years Country Coach had manufactured maybe 300 buses while manufacturing thousands of fiberglass coaches. Thus the paper on pallets and the electronic data on Country Coach Prevost was minute compared to the Intellectual Property pertaining to fiberglass coaches. They identified some Technical Manuals and engaged a computer person to pull some of the electronic data. The Trustee can accept a pre auction bid for assets. He agreed to selling whatever data the Prevost owners wanted for $5,000 (subject to an upset bid at the auction). The Trustee extended the same offer to fiberglass owners as well. Gary Obermeier estimated that the Prevost data identified for purchase included maybe 10,000 drawings. Since each coach may have roughly 4000 drawings, multiplying this by 300 Prevost and you have some idea of how massive the data base is and how little 10,000 drawings represent in the universe of the data base. The same calculation, based on 30 years and several thousand fiberglass coaches, gives you some idea of how difficult it would have been to try and secure, organize and distribute the kinds of data each coach owner would like to have on his coach.
The forgoing represented our best efforts to see if, as part of the liquidation of Country Coach, we could acquire, for Country Coach owners, the kinds of data they would like to have on each of their coaches in anticipation of service, maintenance and repair in a future when, the Country Coach we had all relied upon, no longer existed. The Trustee, the Prevost people, certainly Gary Obermeier, all did everything they could to facilitate the evaluation and purchase of this asset for coach owners. Given the shortness of time take action and the inability to have any assurance that useful data could be obtained, preserved and made available for individual coach units, it was our judgment to let the asset go to auction.
It is our understanding that several potential bidders have expressed an interest in the Intellectual Property asset. They may be interested in acquiring
the company name, the trademarks, any patents etc. Bidders may fully intend to amass the data which owners want and go to the expense and effort to organize it and make it available for purchase. We will know more after the February 4, 2010 sale on that score. We would like to thank those noted herein plus those Country Coach Texans that assisted us with their ideas and strategy, they are Ted Wright, Nick Caruso, Sonny Broome, Jerry McMennamy, Ron Rang and Dave Miller – President of Texas Custom Coach.
Regards,
Stu Entz
The following is a rather lengthy letter drafted by two coach owners...one an attorney and the other an engineer. I offer this as information only as to their extensive research in obtaining records of coaches built over the last 3 decades by Country Coach. The information in the subject files contains minimal information and may not even be as complete as the manuals and information forders provided with each coach. Other records that were stored in computers are virtually non-retrievable due to obsolete programs and lack of specific computer knowledge. I hope this investigation answers those owners who wished to secure these production records.
Respectively, Ted Wright, CCI President L041
COUNTRY COACH WILL BE SOLD AT AUCTION February 4, 2010 Country Coach filed bankruptcy in the Spring of 2009, seeking to reorganize and
continue (commonly referred to as a Chapter 11 Reorganization) . This can be viewed as an effort by the owners, managers and creditors, under the direction of the Court, to restructure the company in such a way that it can pay off its debts in some fashion and operate profitable in time. Due, in large part to the economy, a plan of reorganization could not be put together. The Country Coach matter was then converted from a reorganization to a liquidation (commonly referred to as a Chapter 7, or Straight bankruptcy) and, as the name implies, all of the assets of the company are sold and the proceeds, after all expenses and fees, are allocated among the creditors. The Country Coach auction is set for February 4, 2010. Country Coach, as we have known it through the manufacture of our coaches and annual homecomings and rallies, will be no more.
During the reorganization proceedings, we as Country Coach owners, could only wait and hope that the company would restructure and continue in business. However, when the proceeding was converted to a Chapter 7 and all of the assets were going to be sold at auction, several coach owners began to express concern, principally along the lines of servicing, maintaining and repairing our sizeable investment. More specifically, it narrowed to the question of parts lists, vendor sources, Build Sheets on each and every coach etc, etc. Unlike automobiles, coach's do not all have the same parts, and are not built alike. The question was raised as to how can one obtain this very important information on ones coach for future service, maintenance and repair.
During the last few weeks, we began to look for answers. We turned to the Court records (which are voluminous). We entered into discussions with the Bankruptcy Court Trustee appointed to conduct the auction, Mr. Kenneth Eisler. We reviewed the public information on the sale which listed the assets, one of which was designated as Intellectual Property. Unlike the hard assets of Country Coach such as molds, carpentry tools, (even several coaches in various stages of being built), the Technical Manuals, Build Sheets, engineering drawings, parts lists, vendor lists; everything you might want to know about your coach, all fell as an asset of the company within the category of Intellectual Property. Interestingly, that includes the name "Country Coach" and the various trademarks any patents.
Focusing on this asset we endeavored to determine specifically what was included in the Intellectual Property asset that would be of greatest value to coach owners and in what format. Gary Obermeier, former Senior Vice President of Operations, and a 30 year employee of Country Coach was most helpful and accommodating in this regard. He identified 17 pallets containing boxes of paper all sealed in shrink wrap. Although voluminous he described these records as raw data, largely unorganized, certainly nothing that would provide anything of real value to a coach owner. It was his judgment that the kinds of data that would be both complete and organized were stored electronically. This data would include, for each coach, the drawings, parts numbers, vendor of parts etc. The impossible task was to secure the hardware and software and the knowledge of former CC employees who could still pull from this data. The program no longer exists for extracting the data except as is presently on site in the company's computer room.
It was only last week that we had a full understanding of the nature of information which we thought would be helpful to coach owners and most importantly, its format. Faced with this description of the Intellectual Property, the 17 pallets were deemed to be of no value. Turning to the electronic data base it should be noted that the Trustee, in his responsibility to sell assets, did not maintain a staff that might download electronically stored information. We would have had to hire several key former employees of the company for this work.
A few Prevost owners took it upon themselves to send a person to Eugene for an on-site look. Over the years Country Coach had manufactured maybe 300 buses while manufacturing thousands of fiberglass coaches. Thus the paper on pallets and the electronic data on Country Coach Prevost was minute compared to the Intellectual Property pertaining to fiberglass coaches. They identified some Technical Manuals and engaged a computer person to pull some of the electronic data. The Trustee can accept a pre auction bid for assets. He agreed to selling whatever data the Prevost owners wanted for $5,000 (subject to an upset bid at the auction). The Trustee extended the same offer to fiberglass owners as well. Gary Obermeier estimated that the Prevost data identified for purchase included maybe 10,000 drawings. Since each coach may have roughly 4000 drawings, multiplying this by 300 Prevost and you have some idea of how massive the data base is and how little 10,000 drawings represent in the universe of the data base. The same calculation, based on 30 years and several thousand fiberglass coaches, gives you some idea of how difficult it would have been to try and secure, organize and distribute the kinds of data each coach owner would like to have on his coach.
The forgoing represented our best efforts to see if, as part of the liquidation of Country Coach, we could acquire, for Country Coach owners, the kinds of data they would like to have on each of their coaches in anticipation of service, maintenance and repair in a future when, the Country Coach we had all relied upon, no longer existed. The Trustee, the Prevost people, certainly Gary Obermeier, all did everything they could to facilitate the evaluation and purchase of this asset for coach owners. Given the shortness of time take action and the inability to have any assurance that useful data could be obtained, preserved and made available for individual coach units, it was our judgment to let the asset go to auction.
It is our understanding that several potential bidders have expressed an interest in the Intellectual Property asset. They may be interested in acquiring
the company name, the trademarks, any patents etc. Bidders may fully intend to amass the data which owners want and go to the expense and effort to organize it and make it available for purchase. We will know more after the February 4, 2010 sale on that score. We would like to thank those noted herein plus those Country Coach Texans that assisted us with their ideas and strategy, they are Ted Wright, Nick Caruso, Sonny Broome, Jerry McMennamy, Ron Rang and Dave Miller – President of Texas Custom Coach.
Regards,
Stu Entz
02/05: Country Coach auction
The long wait for Country Coach's fate is coming to an end. While they had been hoping for a white knight to come to their rescue, it didn't happen. The bank cried uncle and a bankruptcy judge agreed several months ago to let them liquidate the company.
Everything from trash cans to nearly million dollar coaches were auctioned today. I spent nearly 8 hours online bidding, but mostly watching in amazement. Some lots were purchased for more than retail, while others were pennies on the dollar.
In the end, I purchased a couple of nearly complete coaches, an Affinity and a Magna. I also bought a 20K generator, power sun visors, day/night shades, cabinet hardware, a Jen Aire refer, side camera mirrors, Villa Ultra-leather furniture, Villa driver and passenger seats and more.
It was a sad day for the small community in Oregon. Many former workers walked around talking to bidders and shaking their heads. They were surprisingly helpful as they freely offered their insider advice and volunteering to be available with others for hire should we want to have work done in the area before taking the motorhomes back home.
There is a glimmer of hope for these workers, as well as orphaned Country Coach owners. It was reported that Bob Lee, the founder of Country Coach, bought the intellectual properties for $160K. Those properties included the name and mailing list. I think he also owns the land and the buildings. If that is true, he could probably open back up after everything is cleared out and start fresh if he could get the backing of lenders. If that isn't his plan, I can't imagine why he would pay $160K for the name! Can you?
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Everything from trash cans to nearly million dollar coaches were auctioned today. I spent nearly 8 hours online bidding, but mostly watching in amazement. Some lots were purchased for more than retail, while others were pennies on the dollar.
In the end, I purchased a couple of nearly complete coaches, an Affinity and a Magna. I also bought a 20K generator, power sun visors, day/night shades, cabinet hardware, a Jen Aire refer, side camera mirrors, Villa Ultra-leather furniture, Villa driver and passenger seats and more.
It was a sad day for the small community in Oregon. Many former workers walked around talking to bidders and shaking their heads. They were surprisingly helpful as they freely offered their insider advice and volunteering to be available with others for hire should we want to have work done in the area before taking the motorhomes back home.
There is a glimmer of hope for these workers, as well as orphaned Country Coach owners. It was reported that Bob Lee, the founder of Country Coach, bought the intellectual properties for $160K. Those properties included the name and mailing list. I think he also owns the land and the buildings. If that is true, he could probably open back up after everything is cleared out and start fresh if he could get the backing of lenders. If that isn't his plan, I can't imagine why he would pay $160K for the name! Can you?
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
I was asked yesterday what I thought about a Good Sam's extended warranty. I've honored them at the dealership for many years, but we've never sold them. I looked them over and have some observations. The main thing is to know what you're buying.
It is sort of a hybrid policy. It's mainly an inclusionary policy, but unlike some others who only tell you what they cover, Good Sam tells you a few things that it doesn't cover, which you normally only see on an exclusionary policy. Another positive is they are backed by insurance, which many aren't.
What's not surprising is how limited the coverages are. That's OK as long as you know it's not going to cover much that's likely to break. Most of the potentially expensive repairs are excluded. If you expect a continuation of the manufacturer's warranty, you're probably not going to be very happy when you go in for most repairs. If you look at it as an insurance policy that will take care of catastrophic failure of the engine or an appliance, then you'll be fine.
Our experience with GS has been good as far as them paying claims on items covered. The policies just don't cover a lot of items or the deductible gets you. So many customer's expectations are too high and get upset. I suspect that most buy online and it's easy to not realize the hundreds of items that are not covered. That's why I like the exclusionary policies. It's all there in black and white. It more closely mirrors the manufacturer's warranty, which the customer is used to. However, a good exclusionary policy is going to cost more. Included in the note, it will usually be much less a month, but for a longer term.
If you have bought a new unit and didn't get an extended warranty, you can still get it, although you won't be able to put it on the loan. However, it is VERY IMPORTANT that you purchase the service contract while it is still in the manufacturer's warranty. If you don't, you will be required to have an RV service center inspect your entire coach and certify it is all in working order. The inspection will cost at least $200 or $300. Anything not working will be required to be repaired. And here's the real kicker--you could have got a 7-year warranty for about the same as a used 2 or 3 year warranty! The warranty companies consider them used if purchased after the manufacturer's warranty runs out. The thinking is there is less likely to have immediate or fraudulent claims if the policy is taken out when the owner is not liable for repairs.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
It is sort of a hybrid policy. It's mainly an inclusionary policy, but unlike some others who only tell you what they cover, Good Sam tells you a few things that it doesn't cover, which you normally only see on an exclusionary policy. Another positive is they are backed by insurance, which many aren't.
What's not surprising is how limited the coverages are. That's OK as long as you know it's not going to cover much that's likely to break. Most of the potentially expensive repairs are excluded. If you expect a continuation of the manufacturer's warranty, you're probably not going to be very happy when you go in for most repairs. If you look at it as an insurance policy that will take care of catastrophic failure of the engine or an appliance, then you'll be fine.
Our experience with GS has been good as far as them paying claims on items covered. The policies just don't cover a lot of items or the deductible gets you. So many customer's expectations are too high and get upset. I suspect that most buy online and it's easy to not realize the hundreds of items that are not covered. That's why I like the exclusionary policies. It's all there in black and white. It more closely mirrors the manufacturer's warranty, which the customer is used to. However, a good exclusionary policy is going to cost more. Included in the note, it will usually be much less a month, but for a longer term.
If you have bought a new unit and didn't get an extended warranty, you can still get it, although you won't be able to put it on the loan. However, it is VERY IMPORTANT that you purchase the service contract while it is still in the manufacturer's warranty. If you don't, you will be required to have an RV service center inspect your entire coach and certify it is all in working order. The inspection will cost at least $200 or $300. Anything not working will be required to be repaired. And here's the real kicker--you could have got a 7-year warranty for about the same as a used 2 or 3 year warranty! The warranty companies consider them used if purchased after the manufacturer's warranty runs out. The thinking is there is less likely to have immediate or fraudulent claims if the policy is taken out when the owner is not liable for repairs.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
There are many extended warranties, or more aptly named, service contracts out there--Some good, most poor in my opinion. I like to break these service contracts down into 4 different categories. Exclusionary or inclusionary, backed by insurance or backed by premiums.
Inclusionary policies have a long and impressive list of all the components that are covered. Exclusionary policies have a short list of items that are not covered. If it's not on the list, it's covered.
The problems I have with inclusionary policies are many, but two things stand out. One is that although it's easy to see what is covered, it's hard to see what isn't covered. You usually find out the hard way when you have a problem and take it into the shop. It's very discouraging to find out that of the 10 items on your list, only a couple are covered.
Which brings me to the second problem. Most people buy the extended service contract thinking that they won't have to pay much of anything to maintain their RV. Sure, they expect to pay to have the oil changed or to reseal the roof, but if anything breaks, they expect their service contract to cover it. Way too often they are disappointed. There's a reason why an inclusionary policy is so much cheaper than an exclusionary policy. It's because it doesn't cover near as much as the exclusionary policy. The inclusionary policy covers dozens of items--the exclusionary covers hundreds and maybe thousands!
The difference between policies backed by premiums and those backed by insurance is very important. Policies backed by premiums must keep generating premiums in order to pay claims. If policy sales slow down for any reason or claims are more than projections, there may not be enough money to pay claims. If the company fails, you're left holding the bag.
Policies backed by insurance is the only way to go, but you will be surprised at how many are not. Take the time to find out. Research the company and get proof of the insurance backing before you buy.
The bottom line is that you should get an exclusionary service contract backed by insurance, in my opinion. It will cost you more, but less in the long run and you will be more satisfied. It will actually pay (isn't that what you bought it for?) when you have a problem. The inclusionary policies also tend to make protocols very complicated and legitimate claims are often denied due to technicalities.
RVers are beginning to realize that getting a good service contract is more of a necessity than optional. I certainly wouldn't own a motorhome without one. The good exclusionary service contract companies routinely pay out 80-90% of the premiums collected in claims. They are professional and aren't trying to get out of claims anyway they can. They realize if they pay claims fairly, the customer will see the value and purchase again from them. Unfortunately, there are too many cheap inclusionary policies out there that simply pay very little.
We represent the Route 66 RV Network service contracts that are administered by Assurant, a multi-billion dollar company that specializes in extended warranty service contracts as well as health insurance. They are by far the most professional extended warranty company I have ever dealt with over the years, and we've represented quite a few. It's nice to have customers happy because most everything is covered after the manufacturer's warranty runs out. Over 95% of our customers purchase the Rt. 66 policy again when they purchase another RV, which speaks volumes.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Inclusionary policies have a long and impressive list of all the components that are covered. Exclusionary policies have a short list of items that are not covered. If it's not on the list, it's covered.
The problems I have with inclusionary policies are many, but two things stand out. One is that although it's easy to see what is covered, it's hard to see what isn't covered. You usually find out the hard way when you have a problem and take it into the shop. It's very discouraging to find out that of the 10 items on your list, only a couple are covered.
Which brings me to the second problem. Most people buy the extended service contract thinking that they won't have to pay much of anything to maintain their RV. Sure, they expect to pay to have the oil changed or to reseal the roof, but if anything breaks, they expect their service contract to cover it. Way too often they are disappointed. There's a reason why an inclusionary policy is so much cheaper than an exclusionary policy. It's because it doesn't cover near as much as the exclusionary policy. The inclusionary policy covers dozens of items--the exclusionary covers hundreds and maybe thousands!
The difference between policies backed by premiums and those backed by insurance is very important. Policies backed by premiums must keep generating premiums in order to pay claims. If policy sales slow down for any reason or claims are more than projections, there may not be enough money to pay claims. If the company fails, you're left holding the bag.
Policies backed by insurance is the only way to go, but you will be surprised at how many are not. Take the time to find out. Research the company and get proof of the insurance backing before you buy.
The bottom line is that you should get an exclusionary service contract backed by insurance, in my opinion. It will cost you more, but less in the long run and you will be more satisfied. It will actually pay (isn't that what you bought it for?) when you have a problem. The inclusionary policies also tend to make protocols very complicated and legitimate claims are often denied due to technicalities.
RVers are beginning to realize that getting a good service contract is more of a necessity than optional. I certainly wouldn't own a motorhome without one. The good exclusionary service contract companies routinely pay out 80-90% of the premiums collected in claims. They are professional and aren't trying to get out of claims anyway they can. They realize if they pay claims fairly, the customer will see the value and purchase again from them. Unfortunately, there are too many cheap inclusionary policies out there that simply pay very little.
We represent the Route 66 RV Network service contracts that are administered by Assurant, a multi-billion dollar company that specializes in extended warranty service contracts as well as health insurance. They are by far the most professional extended warranty company I have ever dealt with over the years, and we've represented quite a few. It's nice to have customers happy because most everything is covered after the manufacturer's warranty runs out. Over 95% of our customers purchase the Rt. 66 policy again when they purchase another RV, which speaks volumes.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
01/26: Tom & Diane Conerty
As many of you know, Tom and Diane Conerty were employed by Lee's RV and before that, Mountain States RV, for many years to represent us at rallies. They were always at the Newmar International Rally, Quartzsite and others.
Sadly, Diane Conerty passed away in late November after being diagnosed with bone cancer only a couple of months before. The Myeloma cancer she had was incurable, but highly treatable in most cases. Unfortunately, she developed complications from the treatment as was gone before anyone was ready.
Tom is one of the most gregarious, upbeat people you will ever meet. He is sort of a modern day Will Rogers--he's never met a man he didn't like. His customers become his friends--for life. He will do most anything to help his friends.
Of course, his wife's death has thrown him for a loop. It was exhausting to do 3 "Celebrations of Life" in 3 different states. He had so little time to prepare for her death--in fact, after the cancer diagnosis they prepared to go on with life in as normal a fashion as they could. That meant they were to continue RVing and spending time with their RV family and friends.
Everyone deals with grief in different ways. There is no wrong way to grieve. The range could be from a few weeks of being stunned, but otherwise acting "normal", up to a spiral into severe depression, lasting many years.
I've visited with Tom and he is determined to do what he thinks Diane would want--and that is to try his best to get back to normal and go on with life. For a person with Tom's personality, that requires lots of interaction with people. While he gets to see his many friends at the RV resort, he still notices that many people are hesitant to contact him. He thinks it's because they really don't know what to say to him and feel uncomfortable.
Tom likes to be doing something all the time. He loves talking to potential customers and helping solve his customer's problems. He tells me that being busy helps keep his mind off things and helps with the healing process. He really wishes more of his friends and acquaintances would treat him normal--call him, stop by, refer friends to him, etc. He doesn't like them to be afraid to call him.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that Tom is my friend and I'm trying to help my friend with the grieving process. This is the best way I know to get the word out. If you know Tom or have been referred to him, don't be afraid to give him a call. He really wants to get back to normal and would appreciate a call. If you prefer email, it's tdconerty@earthlink.net If you need his number, drop me an email at lee@leesrv.com.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Sadly, Diane Conerty passed away in late November after being diagnosed with bone cancer only a couple of months before. The Myeloma cancer she had was incurable, but highly treatable in most cases. Unfortunately, she developed complications from the treatment as was gone before anyone was ready.
Tom is one of the most gregarious, upbeat people you will ever meet. He is sort of a modern day Will Rogers--he's never met a man he didn't like. His customers become his friends--for life. He will do most anything to help his friends.
Of course, his wife's death has thrown him for a loop. It was exhausting to do 3 "Celebrations of Life" in 3 different states. He had so little time to prepare for her death--in fact, after the cancer diagnosis they prepared to go on with life in as normal a fashion as they could. That meant they were to continue RVing and spending time with their RV family and friends.
Everyone deals with grief in different ways. There is no wrong way to grieve. The range could be from a few weeks of being stunned, but otherwise acting "normal", up to a spiral into severe depression, lasting many years.
I've visited with Tom and he is determined to do what he thinks Diane would want--and that is to try his best to get back to normal and go on with life. For a person with Tom's personality, that requires lots of interaction with people. While he gets to see his many friends at the RV resort, he still notices that many people are hesitant to contact him. He thinks it's because they really don't know what to say to him and feel uncomfortable.
Tom likes to be doing something all the time. He loves talking to potential customers and helping solve his customer's problems. He tells me that being busy helps keep his mind off things and helps with the healing process. He really wishes more of his friends and acquaintances would treat him normal--call him, stop by, refer friends to him, etc. He doesn't like them to be afraid to call him.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that Tom is my friend and I'm trying to help my friend with the grieving process. This is the best way I know to get the word out. If you know Tom or have been referred to him, don't be afraid to give him a call. He really wants to get back to normal and would appreciate a call. If you prefer email, it's tdconerty@earthlink.net If you need his number, drop me an email at lee@leesrv.com.
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
01/20: Alternative fuels in RVs?
Going green is all the rage now. However, when the public thinks of green, I'm sure that RVs don't come to mind for most folk. But there are people in the RV industry that are thinking green. Maybe it's because they think they have to, but the point is they are trying to take advantage of the favor "going green" is currently enjoying.
Manufacturers like Jayco are experimenting with composite materials that are lighter than conventional fiberglass sidewalls. They recently introduced the Skylark at the Louisville show that have these composite materials. It was a 22' trailer that weigheds under 4000 lbs. It was also higher priced than their regular Feather Lite, so we'll have to see how much of a premium customers are willing to pay to go green.
Sometimes people talk about supporting green, but don't in practice. I can remember my best friend and his wife talking of not using disposable diapers when they had their first child. They made a big deal about not wanting to contribute to the landfills with non-biodegradable diapers. They could save money, too. That lasted less than 2 months. After that, it was like who cares--I'm done with washing out poopy diapers!
I know that some manufacturers have looked at using fuel cells to power motorhomes, but nothing has become of it yet. We probably won't see any more progress in that area until sales fully recover where they can afford to continue R&D. They probably feel that they will get more bang for their buck investing in lighter towables to be pulled by smaller vehicles.
I've saved the best for last. Last week we had a major natural gas company look at ordering a fleet of gas and diesel motorhomes. They do have the bucks to do R&D. They want to outfit the units to be powered by natural gas along with the regular fuel source. They are talking about mounting natural gas tanks on top of the motorhome that could be switch on at any time. They even are talking of catering to the tailgaters by having natural gas grills that can be set up with quick-connects!
Their plans are in the conceptual phase as far as marketing, but they definitely want to equip these motorhomes to run on natural gas. Ideas considered are marketing direct at football games as a conversion option to be done at authorized dealerships, going in RV shows, convincing manufacturers to offer the option, etc.
It's possible this could revolutionize the industry or it could be a complete bust. I think it depends on the cost. If it were $10K, you would probably have a lot of takers on the diesel pushers, but might get some resistance at the gas motorhome level. If the price were around $5K, I believe it would really take off. Of course, getting more places to fill the tanks would help. Most cities only have a few public places to get it right now. Most put the fill tanks in their garage and slow fill their cars overnight.
In Oklahoma City, they're pumping natural gas today for $1.23 a gallon. The gas company thinks they can have motorhomes double their fuel mileage, when compared with gasoline and diesel. Would that be great or what?! Here's to hoping this becomes a reality in the coming years!
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee
Manufacturers like Jayco are experimenting with composite materials that are lighter than conventional fiberglass sidewalls. They recently introduced the Skylark at the Louisville show that have these composite materials. It was a 22' trailer that weigheds under 4000 lbs. It was also higher priced than their regular Feather Lite, so we'll have to see how much of a premium customers are willing to pay to go green.
Sometimes people talk about supporting green, but don't in practice. I can remember my best friend and his wife talking of not using disposable diapers when they had their first child. They made a big deal about not wanting to contribute to the landfills with non-biodegradable diapers. They could save money, too. That lasted less than 2 months. After that, it was like who cares--I'm done with washing out poopy diapers!
I know that some manufacturers have looked at using fuel cells to power motorhomes, but nothing has become of it yet. We probably won't see any more progress in that area until sales fully recover where they can afford to continue R&D. They probably feel that they will get more bang for their buck investing in lighter towables to be pulled by smaller vehicles.
I've saved the best for last. Last week we had a major natural gas company look at ordering a fleet of gas and diesel motorhomes. They do have the bucks to do R&D. They want to outfit the units to be powered by natural gas along with the regular fuel source. They are talking about mounting natural gas tanks on top of the motorhome that could be switch on at any time. They even are talking of catering to the tailgaters by having natural gas grills that can be set up with quick-connects!
Their plans are in the conceptual phase as far as marketing, but they definitely want to equip these motorhomes to run on natural gas. Ideas considered are marketing direct at football games as a conversion option to be done at authorized dealerships, going in RV shows, convincing manufacturers to offer the option, etc.
It's possible this could revolutionize the industry or it could be a complete bust. I think it depends on the cost. If it were $10K, you would probably have a lot of takers on the diesel pushers, but might get some resistance at the gas motorhome level. If the price were around $5K, I believe it would really take off. Of course, getting more places to fill the tanks would help. Most cities only have a few public places to get it right now. Most put the fill tanks in their garage and slow fill their cars overnight.
In Oklahoma City, they're pumping natural gas today for $1.23 a gallon. The gas company thinks they can have motorhomes double their fuel mileage, when compared with gasoline and diesel. Would that be great or what?! Here's to hoping this becomes a reality in the coming years!
Go camping more--have more fun! Lee